R I P A R A Z I O N E C A M B I O R 1 1 5 0 G S
Contents
1. a 3 ants fhe i 3 is G A a eh e Soak E ee sed i Bo oo i a ET y m 1S aa A This laser temp reader takes out the guesswork After about 30 minuets I m reading 170 F 75 C I decide to give it a try The back half of the trans slips off easily by hand Sweet 3 of 15 Next order of business is to heat the bearing points in the rear cover My biggest fear was to go through all this and not be able to detect a bad bearing All the rear bearings are turning smoothly and seem fine I start heating the front case And heat some more and some more Pe ss Se It shows 205 F 96 C Around 220 F 105 C i ent the input and output shaft bearings are moving easy ready to drop out The intermediate shaft will not budge I go at it for an hour and a half with temps up around 230 F 110 C with no luck I m frustrated Give the heat guns another try I concentrate all the heat on the intermediate shaft 260 F 125 C and still no give I support the intermediate shaft by holding it in one hand with a set of gear puller jaws I elevate the entire assembly off the bench and not wanting to play it too safe give the back of the bell housing a few whacks with a rubber mallet Finally it relents after a dozen of so soft blows I am relieved to see the intermediate bearing clearly looks and feels completely buggered No doubt This is the culprit All three front bearings show signs of discoloration2. Dal forum http www advrider com forums forumdisplay php f 50 bemiiten 26 11 2006 R1150GS 2000 At 55000 miles 88000 km my 00 GS has it s first major problem It seems to be coming from the transmission http www youtube com watch v CShKkyGnLGY The noise disappears soon as the clutch is pulled in Rolling in neutral with clutch out the motor will not make the grinding sound worse Sounds a little rocky in neutral but soon as it s under a slight load all hell brakes loose with a nasty rhythmic rumble grinding sound Trans shifts perfect Oil is new amp full Sounds too bad to be the push rod bearing Anyone had a similar experience with an oil head 6 speeds I m tearing into it to check the driveshaft first Let you all know what I find Jim VonBaden 26 11 2006 R1200GS 2005 Yes that doesn t sound right at all Way more than the typical rumble at idles Just off the cuff it sounds like a clutch plate coming apart But it is hard to say Ricardo Kuhn 26 11 2006 I m pretty sure the rivets on the clutch making contact with the other two plates If the problem was on the shaft you will still ear similar sounds since the shaft never stops rotating bemiiten 27 11 2006 R1150GS 2000 It s not a bad u joint Too easy I don t think it s a clutch problem either The sound stops when the clutch is pulled but 1t means the input shaft unloads and stops spinning The video is a little deceiving I was trying to recreate the sound by applyi
3. but only the intermediate feels bad Input shaft 1 gear Output shaft 6 gears 4 of 15 bemiiten 02 12 2006 R1150GS 2000 Here is a pic of the metallic fuzz on the black magnetic drain plug found at the bottom of the trans mission When I discovered the problem first thing I did was to remove the fill plug to inspect the oil level It was fine Next I drained the gear oil into a clean pan to check for debris with a magnet There was a little bit but the small amount of fine metal particles in the hot oil would give me little concern normally I never removed the black magnetic drain plug on the bottom of the trans before because the cat needed to come off to gain access I found a short 3 8 bolt that has a 9 16 hex 14 mm fit s perfectly I put on two nuts and used a wrench to remove the plug with the exhaust in place I would soon find out that despite the service manual making no reference to remove and clean this plug for normal maintenance not doing so was a major blunder on my part The plug was absolutely filled with super fine metallic fuzz I cleaned it up refilled the trans and decided to take the bike for one last ride around the block to listen to the grinding noise one more time and to shoot the video I should mention I drained the final drive just to make sure that the noise wasn t being transmitted somehow to the trans Nothing at all was found on the drain plug Here is a picture after I cleaned the trans
4. Changing to the red oil did it The case is improperly machined hence the reason the bearing would not come out while all the rest were falling out at a much lower temp Shit happens Just a few of my opinions The fuzz isn t a concern unless it had very discernable chunks or flakes of metal on it Normal wear and tear along with break in will create very small fuzzy particles that nicely stick to the magnetic pick up The different color of your oils means nothing They have different colors so I wouldn t worry about that I would bet that it was just your time It seems like you did all the correct maintenance so I wouldn t blame yourself My plan for shimming consists of carefully measuring the assembled length of the existing shafts After the bearings are removed I will compare them to the new ones as well This should hopefully result in me being able to match the same size that came out One big assumption here is that they were shimmed properly to begin with This is uncharted territory for me so any knowledge or suggestions would be greatly appreciated AntonLagiader 21 03 2007 R100PD Don t assume anything is shimmed right Every 6 speed I ve worked on is loose somewhere The manual I have does give shaft lengths but that doesn t mean much I always check them the old fashioned way shaft protrusion ndr sporgenza vs cover depth I ve measured a bunch of cases and covers and have a decent idea of what th
5. the input shaft splines look like they have some life left in them a TT ee On _ r The clutch disk splines look a bit worse I decide that replacing just the disk will accelerate the wear on both parts with their mismatched matting surfaces so it makes sense to replace both while the trans is apart Their is a lot of debate over the toughness of BMW s dry clutch I don t abuse my clutch nor do I hesitate to slip it as much as needed when the situation calls for it Compared to a new disk the friction material shows very little wear and in my case would proba bly outlast the splines by a wide margin Old clutch measures 6 32 mm new one 6 70 mm Manual shows a wear limit of 4 8 mm Old disk New disk 11 of 15 bemiiten 21 03 2007 R1150GS 2000 The manual calls for no more than 002 deviation from an end play value it does not give I decided that if the bearings are exactly the same as what came out then that is my better bet then to base shim size on inaccurate information bemiiten 13 01 2007 R1150GS 2000 Still waiting on one last part I post some pictures of the failed transmission shaft bearing At the left is the culprit bearing You can see that the sealed bearing is out of it s lubricant The seal shows metal shavings from the failure Middle one is same made in japan bearing as left also looking like it has some shavings and not much of whatever it is they pack these with I
6. 06 R1150GS 2000 I had one front intermediate shaft bearing that was clearly bad and a leaking input shaft seal The other two front bearings also show sings of overheating with the output shaft bearing discol ored as bad as the intermediate but turning smoothly I decided to replace all six The parts have arrived from Chicago BMW 3 weeks after I placed the order I set up a dial indicator to measure the overall length of the assembled intermediate shaft I get repeatable results with this method I also used a digital caliper to measure overall length but found the results to be too varied to fully trust The intermediate shaft was placed in the freezer while I heated a 1 set collar on top a kerosene heater The manual shows pulling the bearing with a puller but I decided to do the removal with a press in stead I removed the frozen shaft and placed it on top of the heated set collar to warm the bearing for a few minuets I installed the bearing clamp and put the assembly in the press The clearance between the gear and bearing is extremely tight As soon as the bearing moved a little the clamp was tightened to allow a better bite The freezing and heating paid off when the bearing came off nicely without excessive force 7 of 15 The original failed intermediate bearings are from Japan The replacements are from Poland same part The original output shaft bearings are from England the replacements are also
7. ase I heat the rear case and slide it home paying attention that the seals are started properly Torque the case bolts in a crisscross manner and drive home the two drift pins last I let the gasket sealer set before filling the transmission with gear oil 13 of 15 To seis the mid life refreshing here are the parts 1 that were nA oa a i Ai TO e f f akaissi I coat the splines with Honda molly 60 a little more generously then the first spline lube because the splines looked dry again after only 20 000 miles I put a dot of red paint on the driveshatt to make it easier to os I have ues properly Make sure the ends of the retaining ring for the Paralever boot are in the horizontal axis to avoid in terference I replaced the rear Paralever pivot bearings that were overdue for replacement The front were still good I cheated and used blue Loctite for the stationary pivot and nothing on the adjustment side to facilitate adjustment later if needed An other small dot of red paint on the pivot and adjustment bolts will give me a visual confirmation that nothing is loose 14 of 15 I spent an other 100 00 to replace a perfectly good clutch slave cylinder That little bearing has seen about a bazillion revolutions Hmmm Doing some preventive maintenance I decide to clean up some of the rust on the clutch line bemiiten 04 04 2007 R1150GS 2000 First ride and the bike s shift action is really smooth I pu
8. do see what looks like the red trans fluid on the bearing cage Maybe the synthetic penetrates the seal and dilutes the grease The last on right is an output shaft bearing made in England Looks like it has much more lu bricant left then the other two bemiiten 21 03 2007 R1150GS 2000 I noticed this little bite out of one of locating gp pin bores ndt fori EEn The trans housing precludes setting your drift ndt attrezzo spina d allineamento for a straight shot Had to use a smaller 3 16 4 75 mm drift at an angle and it resulted in this BMW must have an offset drift for this as I recall it didn t make sense to drive the pin from the opposite side Anyway this picture is after I removed a small aluminum burr ndr truciolo Poolside 21 03 2007 What am I looking at here Is this a spherical head pin Used to drift the case halves apart If so next time you may rebuild one for a friend put an inverted cone shape on the drift Use a piece of cold rolled rod the diameter you want and face drill it for the inverted cone shape And radius the circumference of the face on a stone wheel bemiiten 21 03 2007 R1150G8S 2000 Thanks The problem was not being able to use the proper size pin due to having to cock it in the bore because part of the trans case is in the way This resulted in the punch nicking the case visible at the top of the pin It was an air angle grinder punch by the way lIl apply the appropriate kin
9. el free spinning Does it do it under load Does it do it with the trans in neutral and the clutch handle released pulled in bemiiten 28 11 2006 R1150GS 2000 The video shows the bike on the center stand wheel spinning in first gear It is normal for the trans to make a lot of noise under this condition but not on the road with a steady smooth load When the bike is in neutral it really isn t too noticeable Put the bike in any gear and apply a load from slight to full out and it 1s a horrible unmistakable cyclic grinding Sounds like choo choo choo choo It speeds up with road speed Pull in the clutch and it all but disappears The noise started while riding this weekend By the time I was sure I was hearing something wrong and pulled out the earplugs to confirm I was 75 miles from home I rode it back with no issues except the grinding Convinced that it is a trans shaft bearing I hope I can find evidence when I open the trans Pulled the black magnetic drain plug on the bottom of the trans to find it filled with fine metallic fuzz but nothing any bigger I never pulled the magnetic drain plug before and I wished I had So if you have a 1150 do yourself a favor and clean it off next service The bearings in the trans are sealed which means any grindings should stay in the bearing The leak at the clutch housing has been there for 15 000 miles I figured it to be the rear main seal ring because I could not detect any gear oil
10. ey should be They re generally repeatable within about 0 05mm Again none of the numbers mean anything Measure your parts as if it were an Airhead tranny slideways 03 12 2006 The bearings are pressed on the shafts and interference fit into the cases For installing the bearings on the transmission shaft I would put the entire axle in the freezer over night Then find a socket that matches the inner race on the bearing and heat it red hot on the stove Put the hot socket on the inner race for a minute then pull the shaft axle out of the freezer and the bearing should slide right on When installing new bearings into the cases I always put shaft with bearings in the freezer over night and usually they just drop into the cases If you need to extract any blind side bearings from the transmission cases use bearing puller johnjen 03 12 2006 While the original shimming will still be close changing the bearings will usually change the shimming measurement If you want to use our method try this At room temperature make your measurements write them down 6 of 15 Then freeze the parts and re measure the shimming dimensions while really cold Then heat the parts up to say 200 F 93 C and measure them again Then determine the range of the shims from cold to hot From here you can either split the difference or weight the shim dimension more towards the hot side where the tranny usually operates bemiiten 28 12 20
11. from Poland updated part All the bearings new and old measure the exact same thickness Better don t use the caliper it is sensitive to hand pressure and I m sure that s the 001 difference After a more accurate measurement with a dial gauge the bearings were indeed the same size All the bearings seem to be made to very tight tolerances Old bearing New bearing To my thinking this means I am replacing apples with apples and their should be no reason to re shim the shafts right Wrong After allowing the shaft to warm back up to room temperature I m showing a difference of about 007 shorter The manual list a maximum difference of 002 8 of 15 The manual gives no absolute overall dimension for the shafts and no inside dimension for the trans case Just a 002 figure that I assume is endplay I can only compare what I had to what I have now AntonLagiader 21 03 2007 R100PD Don t assume anything is shimmed right Every 6 speed I ve worked on is loose somewhere The manual I have does give shaft lengths but that doesn t mean much I always check them the old fashioned way shaft protrusion vs cover depth I ve measured a bunch of cases and covers and have a decent idea of what they should be They re generally repeatable within about 0 05mm Again none of the numbers mean anything Measure your parts as if it were an Airhead tranny bemiiten 28 12 2006 R1150GS 2000 Here is the procedure I used for installing t
12. he bearings I start by using a washer to absolutely guar antee that no force is exerted on the outer race I freeze the shaft and use a heat gun on the new bearings When the bearings hit about 150 F 65 C I carefully line up everything in the press It is easy to feel when the bearing is fully seated Next up is the output shaft The bearings are removed along with the adjoining gears I follow the same procedure as before and wind up with similar results About 006 shorter overall This should read zero the bearings are the same size One step I failed to take was making sure the old bearings were pressed fully home It s in the manual but I neglected this step It s the only possibility I can think of I m very confident the bearings are the exact same size Last is the input shaft Like before a comparison of old and new bearings show them to be exactly the same Old bearing New bearing While inspecting the transmission engagement moet dogs on the other shafts I could not help but be impressed at just how good the condition of these parts were This can t be good This is the thrust block of the input shaft disassembled Check out that nice crack on the left ear I suppose it could be just a gouge but it extends to far to be from some debris getting in between the mating surfaces It is on the power side There is just no way this can go back in 10 of 15 After 55k and one spline lube at 35k
13. k next time 12 of 15 bemiiten 21 03 2007 R1150GS 2000 After searching around LOCTITE 515 is what I decided on for a gasket sealer I made the decision to install the seals in the cases before hand The depth of the rear output shaft seal is critical as there is a oil hole that could be covered if its driven in a few mm too far Installing the seals first means that caution must be taken when heating the cases that the seal is not directly exposed to the blast of the heat gun I used sockets as a shield I also covered all the splines with a plastic wrap to protect the seals during assembly I used gear oil sparingly I clean the gasket surface with proper solvent and make sure I have everything oriented properly With the assembled transmission shafts still in the freezer I begin to heat the front case with 2 heat guns Getting all three shafts plus one shift fork into case all at once is a little tricky The laser thermometer is very useful to decide when you are ready to install the shafts The case must be hot enough for the bearings to freely slide home I neglected to take pictures because I wanted to get the transmission assembled and the cases torqued as quickly as possible to take advantage of the rapidly warming transmission shafts With the seals already in place I want to use as little heat as possible so as to not damage them When the shafts and shifting mechanism are installed I apply the Loctite 515 to the front c
14. ng some rear brake in gear to simulate a load The sound of the trans teeth rattling overshadow the cyclic rumble that is best heard in the last 25 seconds of the recording This rumble is much worse under load and sounds like a bearing running with no lubrication The sound has me convinced it s a trans shaft bearing Input shaft bearing perhaps Beginning to wander if this has something to do with it No choice now but to pull it off and open the tranny and have a look 1 of 15 Banjax 28 11 2006 R1150GS My 1150 sounds just like that as well On centerstand gear engaged let out clutch Bag of spanners in the washing machine What does it sound like when you ride it normally on the street Is it the same Mine sounds normal under these circumstances I have been told that the angle of the drive shaft when on the stand is too much and it creates noise That and the motors power pulses thru the transmission when its unloaded cause vibration Gros Buck 03 12 2006 R1200GS 05 I own a 05 1200gs that does the same thing I heard Getrag transmission does that all the time I double check with another GS at my dealer Same noise whenever you put the bike on central stand with the wheel engaged and spinning in the back This noise could be reduced with thicker oil But I agree it does not sound healthy Jim VonBaden 28 11 2006 R1200GS 2005 Just to be clear In gear Clutch handle released Was it on the centerstand with the rear whe
15. plug once already I rode the bike less than a mile and managed to pic up this much more debris You can bet that this will be coming out at every service from now on Jim Bud 02 12 2006 R1150GS ADV Other than the bearing the rest of the trans looks to be in pretty good shape It s possible your box started out life with a problematic bearing I think I will check my magnetic plug next time Dropping the exhaust system is not all that hard It will give me a reason to take off the center stand and give it a complete lube rebuild bemiiten 02 12 2006 R1150GS 2000 This is the oil recommended by the dealer I normally use what is called for in the manual I already was using the 75 140 before I discovered the fact that it calls for 90w This issue has been debated here before Over the years the container has been changed cee o eaa Bis a but what came out looked the same BMW s ee we eS latest lubricant is now red in color where the old stuff was the normal gold brown color This set off alarm bells at my last fluid change 5 000 miles later bearing failure So I m left wandering why shit happens 5 of 15 So what do you think The fuzz found in the oil it s way into the bearing and destroyed it The large amount of fuzz is from the bearing failure The bearing was improperly shimmed at the factory but took 55k to fail The catalytic converter s excess heat played a role in cooking the bearings
16. smell bemiiten 29 11 2006 R1150GS 25 n dgio h Here s a trick to help get the clutch disk centered Trace around the pressure plate with a pencil and you can use the marks to confirm the disk is centered assuming the same disk is going back in Not so sure about this one Manual shows a wear limit of 4 8mm this one measures 6 3mm Looks like the rear main seal ring is not the source of my leak La tome eee The trans input shaft ela Pres a CUT ce ee ek lm be The trans input seal on the other hand 4wheeldog 29 11 2006 Looks to me like you may have the input shaft spline problem Your clutch disc splines look worn out and the input shaft appears to have a lot of taper Did you have problems shifting bemiiten 29 11 2006 R1150GS 2000 Bike shifts fine Splines look OK in person I did a spline lube at 35k At 55k the splines are dry again even after using the Honda molly 60 The spline wear looks about the same as before bemiiten 01 12 2006 R1150GS 2000 Smoking gun found I use a long drift ndt cacciaspine to drive out the two pins where the two halves of the trans mate I heat up the case first to loosen them up a bit and add a little penetrating fluid They take a considerable whack to move so the heat seems like a good idea even though the manual makes no mention for this step I use two heat guns for 15 minutes meas e Lii pr F WA i h 4
17. t in a new indent arm and spring because they cost under 20 00 for the pair I did detect the slightest unhappiness with the old one when turning the roller under pressure Between that and the new splines with fresh lube shifting seems better then before When I first rode this bike I thought the clutch action was a little grabby After a while it worked very well I was worried the new clutch plate might be grabby until broken in That isn t the case as right out of the box the clutch has very good feel without a hint of gabbiness I also made a switch to synthetic dot 4 in the clutch So only a few hundred miles so far but everything is dry and sounding good A summary The biggest issue with this job was the wait for parts About 3 weeks Partially my fault for not ordering everything the first time I did not expect to have to replace the thrust block on the input shaft 3 weeks Screwed up the clutch line my fault 3 weeks Being that the weather was still really lousy here it was not a big deal but if it had been prime rid ing season In the end I am assuming the failure stemmed from the bearing using up all it s lifetime lubricant 15 of 15
Download Pdf Manuals
Related Search